Reasons, rewards and incentives. These are, I think, the key.
Successful learners (at anything, not just Welsh) will always have one or more of these in mind, and usually will have come up with them themselves (i.e. reasons such as family heritage, rewards such as personal satisfaction in gaining another language, incentives such as job opportunities, etc).
The people who haven’t found their reason/reward/incentive are the ones we ideally need to tempt - somehow we need to show that speaking Welsh can provide so many more benefits than the one you first think of.
Welsh as a superpower - suddenly you can double the amount of opportunities available to you. You can see previously ‘invisible’ literature. You can hear previously ‘inaudible’ music. You can experience previously ‘secret’ events.
I think you’ve got the core of a brilliant campaign there…
Great idea. I think we have to be a little bit careful with the word ‘secret’, as it could play into the hands of the ‘Welsh is a closed secret elite club’ lobby.
But still, I really like the overall idea.
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Yes I like the idea of a superpower. And the idea of opening up worlds. After I went to Tafwyl I thought of the “two worlds” thing as being a bit like Harry Potter - that there is this whole culture hidden in plain site. And all my life I thought I was a muggle, but I am a wizard after all! Because what else is speaking Welsh but making magic.
[quote=“KateM, post:17, topic:8744”]
And all my life I thought I was a muggle, but I am a wizard after all! Because what else is speaking Welsh but making magic.
[/quote] 
Sometimes it is best to just ignore critisism, but I’m not sure we can on this one.
Some people question the existence of Welsh. This is especially true in British Wales (North East Wales and Coastal resorts), in which a not insignifcant amount of the population live.
For many in this area, the idea that the Welsh government might want to increase the number of Welsh speakers is a mystery. Why do they want to do that? Why have Welsh at all? Why would a GOVERNMENT want to increase numbers? Shouldn’t they focus on schools/hospitals etc?
Perhaps the Million Speakers project could look at answering this question. Possible answers;
- Increased quality of life (two world viewpoints)
- Preserve tradition
- Preserve and devlop a culture
- Developed sense of self for citizens
- Internal market for Welsh goods and services
- Allowing people to have academic and family reasons for using/learning the language.
The project could also look to displace these reasons for not increasing numbers;
- Duplication
- Misunderstanding (road signs etc)
- Doesn’t help promote a united UK
- Potentially lower globalisation
P.S. This has been discussed to some extent here: Welsh language on BBC R4's Today programme million speakers
yes, it’s the same in SE Wales where I’m originally from. I think the main reason for this is that Welsh history has been whitewashed from the school history curriculum for so long. In my opinion that is the source of ‘Welsh is a dead language’ and ‘all Welsh speakers are Nationalists’. Once you enter the ‘parallel universe’ of Welsh speaking, that history is there and everything starts to fall into place and of course those myths are debunked. I’m sure there must be bits of Welsh history that can be utilised for encouraging uptake of the language - rather than always defaulting to the bits often referred to to explain/blame its decline (such as the Blue Books for instance) which will be discovered by the learners eventually anyway.
We don’t just need to focus on the ‘how’ (important though that is), we definitely need to build a solid, encouraging base of ‘why’ by reinforcing the points you’ve made above.
I always travel from platform 9 3/4 at Aber station. 
I’d add to that the value for tourism. For lots of travellers, having a go at a new language, even with just a basic phrasebook, is one of the key pleasures of the holiday. The more people willing to speak to tourists in Welsh, the more eager visitors!
I feel there is a lot of focus on teaching children in Welsh (which, of course, is vital) but it is also essential that people can actually use Welsh in their day to day lives. The language needs to be heard!
I think it should be compulsory for all businesses in Wales to get their Welsh speaking staff to wear the Cymraeg logo. Either with a pin, on a lanyard or as part of the uniform (as they do at Ysbyty Gwynedd).
It would be such a small, easy change but it would make such a massive difference. Straight away, we would all know that we’re welcome to speak Welsh!
This is part of the All Wales uniform.
Since beginning to learn Welsh I have realised what fantastic resources there are for learning the language. Not just SSIW but TV and radio shows geared to learners, websites, etc. With most languages that one can learn, it’s usual to end up with the impression that as a learner you are in a small minority of speakers of that language, where the vast majority are fluent speakers who don’t care that much whether or not you learn their language. With Welsh, it feels like learners are a huge part of the community of Welsh speakers, and that also by learning the language we are part of what will come to be viewed as an important part of history: the return of Welsh to the main language in Wales.
I wonder whether these aspects of learning Welsh could be promoted to people thinking of learning a second language. With all the current efforts to get people learning Welsh, it’s a great time to be a learner in order to benefit from the great resources and support on offer, and to feel as if one’s efforts are valued and appreciated by those who are fighting to promote the language.
DiolchI don’t know whether you are familiar with Think Without Limits: you CAN speak Welsh by Lynda Pritchard Newcombe? It is an excellent overview of the problems learners have in actually going out into the community and using the Welsh they have learned. One of the (many) problems she mentions is the native Welsh speaker’s fear of talking with learners. There are several reasons for this, but one issue that needs addressing is the native speaker’s lack of confidence in their own language. They are not only terrified that the learner will ask them about treigladau, but I have seen advanced learners criticise the vocabulary of native speakers and their use of colloquial Welsh – and this was to their faces! This is not going to encourage native speakers to engage with learners!
I’m not saying that all native speakers should become Welsh tutors, but courses or materials to help support those native speakers who are willing to talk with learners would be one positive step.
This is a very good point. There needs to be some way of overcoming this fear where it exists, and also supporting native Welsh speakers to encourage them to speak to learners.
Speaking to learners can be quite daunting. I think about this when I am speaking to other learners who are just starting out: what do they know/understand; should I avoid using the short form; should I correct anything; if I use a word they look confused by, should I tell them what it is in English or try to explain it in Welsh or mime it, etc, etc. With SSiWers it’s much easier - the sentence structures have been built and it’s a matter of slotting some extra words in. So I just go with saying whatever comes out first (including loads of mistakes) and if it doesn’t work, find a different way of saying the same thing. However, with people who’ve done the traditional classroom course, the conversation always seems to go, ‘Where do you live?’, ‘Where do you come from originally?’ and talk about the weather.
I have been in conversation classes where Welsh speakers have come in (in pairs!) and they are provided with a list of questions on a topic by the tutor to discuss with groups of learners (who have practised some of these beforehand). This has helped to an extent, but it results in a bit of a stilted conversation that’s not very natural.
At the Cymdeithas yr Iaith one-day conference recently, there was a presentation about the Cylch Teifi monthly walks. These are usually two thirds Welsh speakers, one third learners. Everyone is encouraged to mix (learners aren’t left to chat with each other) and the speakers do not turn back to English. I have been on one of those and it certainly seems to work.
Of course the place where everyone talks ‘naturally’, with whatever Welsh they have, is Bootcamp. Iestyn doesn’t give the impression that he’s speaking any differently than he would normally, but then he is used to talking to children! 
Do you change the Welsh you use @Iestyn? Could you put a package together on how to hold conversations with learners?
The issue of native speakers lack of confidence comes up quite a lot. One of my neighbours tends to speak to me in English and says her Welsh ‘isn’t good enough’, because in the past she has been corrected by her daughter who is a teacher. My other neighbours speak to me in Welsh, but they have commented that I use Welsh words for some things where normally they would slot in an W/English one, so even that can be off-putting.
Finally, one tutor told me that they don’t like teaching very advanced groups of learners because the class spends their time trying to ‘catch the tutor out’! Learners need to be taught how to speak to native speakers too!
Oh dear, oh dear! would anyone ever consider correcting a French person’s French? If only we could gather all Welsh speakers and tell them we are very grateful for their help and patience and croeso caredig! And warn all teachers that correcting someone’s native language is hardly polite and is very presumptuous, so,please tell learners to refrain from so doing! I could cry wth frustration! 
I’m trying to build on a couple of comments already made in this thread and the “Problems” post. I’ve not read the three “How to” ones yet, so I may be repeating suggstions made there.
My first impressions/responses are based on this quote (sorry, I’ve lost track of who wrote it in the “Problems” thread, I think it might have been Kate):
“I agree too but I think we could be in danger of getting a bit circular, if the problem is that those who speak Welsh already don’t use it, and that’s the reason more people don’t learn, and the reason they don’t use it is because not enough people have learned it …”
So, as I see it:
- the everyday use of the language needs to become more visible in general.
- there ought to be less of a “this is for learners” and “this is for native speakers” divide. Not only can this split build on the existing inferiority complexes / angst of both groups, I feel that sometimes it reinforces the impression that the language is a nice-to-have add-on and that it is more of a stick than a carrot approach (also also discussed before). The attitude “You’re not a learner, you’re either a speaker or not” ought to prevail. Just because you are not a native of that country does not mean you can’t be a speaker of its language. (I don’t think I’m expressing this too well, but I hope all readers understand what I’m trying to get at here).
This means there needs to be more events available in Welsh in general, which are simply promoted as events for people interested in XYZ topic. The more of these events there are, the more people will realise how many things are conducted in the language, even if they don’t speak it yet. The non-speakers might be encouraged to learn, and those who speak it (of all levels) will be encouraged to participate.
How I think we can do this:
- if individual SSiWers try to organise and promote something in their area based on one of their own hobbies (a one-off event, or a regular group - e.g. a guided walk, a book club (even if it is to read Blodwen Jones to start with), a young farmers’ meeting) that doesn’t specifically revolve around learning Welsh, but happends to be conducted through the medium of Welsh, this would raise numbers. You wouldn’t necessarily have to lead the event, but could find someone in your community who would be willing to, e.g. a Welsh-speaking yoga instructor.
- on a larger scale, how about trying to organise (or even lobby for the Welsh Government to organise) a regional brochure, directory, display in the local community centre/library/village noticeboard or something that lists all of the local events/groups, etc. This would let people know what really is out there, and elminiate the “there’s nothing in my area in Welsh” excuse.
Finally, as someone who is obsessed with languages and language learning (Welsh is my 3rd foreign language I can speak at an intermediate level and 5th language in total), I think another major problem is overcoming the mono-lingual person’s attitude towards language learning. Whenever you read a “bucket list”, one of the top few items is “learn a foreign language”. Many people start every year as part of their NY resolutions, but very few succeed. This is because:
- most people assume they need to be taught adn don’t do anything to help themselves outside lessons
- very few people really know how to learn
We need to find some way of showing people how to learn languages effectively on their own and not how to learn Welsh specifically. If there were courses that enticed people to attend “under the guise” of learning a language, with examples of resources using German/Spanish/French/Italian/Russian/Chinese/Welsh, etc. this would give people the motivation and once again would be a way of placing Welsh along with the ‘mainstream’ languages, rather than placing a specific emphasis on it, which plays on the split/divide I mentioned above. (I recall someone in the Problems thread also mentioning the attitude of friends regarding the learning of Italian/French and Welsh).
I hope some of this mini-thesis helps in some way!
Great input, Karen, diolch yn fawr iawn! I’ll make sure I transfer what I can from there to the Trello board over the next few days…
I think SSIW is an incredible resource and I am amazed at the foundation that it gave me. I wonder what it would take to make SSIW an (almost) household app like duolingo (which didn’t help me that much tbh). Perhaps leaving leaflets or notices in bars, cafes, pubs etc?
Whenever asked how I started learning, I always write down this site on a piece of paper and tell them to give it a go- thats how I first started!
Maybe a bit of publicity perhaps? Has anything ever been done with BBC Wales or BBC Radio Wales?