There is a background here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Landsker_Line
I don’t want to get too socio-political, but in some other European countries, the English-speaking people of South Pembrokeshire would be regarded as a colourful and valued cultural minority. Having the cultural, economic and political power of England sitting right next door means that the actual situation is immensely more complex, of course.
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After reading the wikipedia entry and this sentence in particular:
“A 2003 DNA study[6] showed that people in ‘Little England’ are genetically indistinguishable from the people of southern England.”
this thing is getting real weird. 
I’m not sure want to go deep into real complex issues for today.
Just one more question: I had the impression that the bigger obstacle to Welsh becoming more commonly used was the fact that everybody in Wales are English-speakers anyway except maybe a tiny minority of older people in the middle of nowhere.
Now it seems I was wrong?
(apologies for my ignorance about Wales!)
No, I think you’re probably right. When you already speak the same language as the rest of the UK, where’s the incentive to learn another one? It’s probably mostly apathy - people don’t care enough about Welsh to learn it, and then of course they’re not able to teach their children, and it’s kind of a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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…and the thing is it realy doesn’t take that many people to start doing it for the pattern to knock on.
For example, I’ve heard loads of my friends say they’ve felt more comfortable about asking for something in Welsh in a shop because they heard somene closer in the queue speaking Welsh or similar - and by doing so, you’re probably encouraging someone who is behind you in the queue.
I don’t have the stats to back it up, but I reckon just 50 or so people doing this every weekend in Cardiff City Centre could make an absolutely humoungus difference to the amount of conversations that occur in Welsh.
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While we’re on the topic of starting a conversation in Welsh when in Wales, I seem to remember a while ago a discussion on the Forum about some of the Welsh who actually resent use of the Welsh language (sad, but…).
Is one ever likely to run into any best-avoided aggression on this matter?
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Well, my answer to that Baruch is; that’s their problem. I’m not going to let people like that stop me from using my language. Confrontation will be avoided at all costs but I won’t be thwarted by such attitudes.
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My impression is that in some ways it’s easier for a foreigner like me to take learning Welsh lightly and just try and speak, there:
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I think fluent speakers don’t really expect foreign tourists to know Welsh, so I can guess they might be more patient and more amused than annoyed by my attempts (and myself, less inclined to negative self-judgement when I fail)!
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I don’t feel any pressure to learn it because “I should”, because my family would have liked it, because I am Welsh or live in Wales, because of my DNA, because I have to study it at school…or whatever.
I am free to do it just because I enjoy it. I suspect this might make the process easier for many people over there.
Oh not to mention the fact that it would be great fun for me to pretend to believe everybody would speak Welsh, in Wales. And tell to anyone not speaking Welsh and reacting with a negative attitude something like “I’m surprised you don’t, you’ve been living here all your life!” 
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Brilliant answer - diolch!
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Very interesting, thanks, @robbruce — I also had no idea of the historical background. Good point too about the “cultural minority”!
I don’t know the 2003 study, but a well quoted one in 2015 suggested the same, but these studies have to be read properly, since the 2015 one is often misquoted deliberately. The studies tend to use samples of people whose familes on both sides have lived in a close area for at least three generations - there is obviously a good reason for doing that, but this is, by definition, a very specific subset of the actual population, which has to interpreted with caution. In the 2015 study often quoted there were 2000 people sampled across the whole of the UK and it gave a DNA snapshot for the relatives at the end of the nineteenth century.
The samples for Pembrokeshire will probably only be based on a handful of people and places like Pembrokeshire might have seen significant outmigration before and after the end of the nineteenth century to industrial south wales or abroad. The sort of static population members might be specific groups, like landowners, the more affluent farmers etc and these might very well have been English.
None of these studies are good enough to make the big conclusions that people often jump to and I don’t think they really tell us anything definitive.
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I love this idea! But it doesn’t work so well in the United States. HA! Sometimes, even my Wife gets tired of me speaking Cymraeg.
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Precisely, with migration in both directions for centuries DNA gets commingled and results must be interpreted correctly. For example, My DNA results from 23&Me stated I was 69.5% English (Welsh is not a selected population). I said, “No I’m Welsh. Last name is Jones and there are 3 generations of hard rock miners, all with the Jones surname. I’m Welsh!” I’ve since been told that was a very “Welsh” thing to do. HA!
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All of the human race share about 99% of the same DNA - a large amount of our DNA is common to bacteria and many ancient organisms and these studies are talking about the differences in the other 1% or less. Also most of these studies are talking about mitochondrial DNA, which is inherited from the mother. This form of DNA persists unchanged for millenia and has been used to track population movements etc, but it only tells you half the story or less.
Although there will be remnants of the male side of your family going back many generations and these will have a very significant effect on your general physical and other features etc, it is much harder to study or trace.
The 2015 study above said that the Orkney islands had the most distinctively different DNA in the UK and what that really means was that in the small subset they studied - very few if any women with genes common elsewhere were part of the study sanple. Wales was the next most distinctive part of the UK in terms of genes with no markers for Anglo Saxon genes in any of their sample.
We know there was significant migration from England in the nineteenth century to the industrialised Welsh valleys, but overwhelmingly this would have been men migrating - the amount of women migrating would have been lower, so there will be very few markers for what might be thought of as non-preexisting DNA.
Its very complicated and people make sweeping statements sometimes which don’t really stack up.
My DNA would probably show up as very typical of other people in Wales, since all my maternal lines were all from Wales going back as far as can be traced, but I’m proud that I have Great Great Grandfathers on both sides who were immigrants, but very little of their DNA will be detectable now even though I might strike a starting resemblance to one of them and to many very distant relatives in England who have never been to Wales.
What I’m trying to get at is that you could be a spitting image of one of your Welsh ancestors on the male side, but even the best of scientists would be very hard pushed to identify the genes or markers that code for it
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Strangely, the DNA result my town in the NE of England came out as not being connected to the rest of England, which surrounds it, but was connected to Celtic areas of the West coast. Also the Wiki map of Welsh speakers shows Newcastle and London as the only English towns to be Welsh speaking. 
. Yes, I know. However, when the FB group disputed this, suggesting that there would be no Welsh speakers, I couldnt resist commenting:. Shwmae, John o Newcastle 'ma 
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It’s always interesting to read all these details about these studies (like in your posts).
However, one thing I really didn’t understand is why the Wikipedia entry seems to focus so much on these studies.
Even assuming there was 100% proof that people in that area are genetically indistinguishable from those in Southern England…well…so what?
It would be quite surprising if they were exact match with a population in Turkey or Siberia. But, I mean, Southern England is basically just a few miles away!!!
Anyway still around DNA [quote=“delawarejones, post:53, topic:13835”]
My DNA results from 23&Me stated I was 69.5% English (Welsh is not a selected population).
[/quote]
I had quite a few American friends doing these tests so I got curious and did it myself. Most results, in my case, are quite obvious - all over Southern and Central Europe, where I already know I have ancestors.
The unexpected matches for me, which apparently can be dated within a few centuries back, happen to be in Scotland.
At this point I hope that they spoke Scottish Gaelic and that somewhere in my DNA there’s a memory of it so that it can make my Welsh learning easier! 
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Or maybe even Old Welsh! 
- the earliest Welsh poetry originated in Southern Scotland, i.e. Hen Ogledd: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hen_Ogledd
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It’s to do with how we should interpret our history and I think then putting forward a theories that can fit the desired facts.
The history of these islands has usually been portrayed as the Anglo-Saxons invaded, slaughtered everyone and the original Britons ran off to the hills and survived.
The studies don’t refute that hypothesis or support it, but a theory was put forward to suggest it didn’t happen like that and it’s reassuring for some people to support that idea.
There is little evidence for Vikings having much effect on the gene-pool in North East England, but then again I doubt they brought their wife’s and partners with them when they were supposedly raping and pillaging - it doesn’t mean they left no genetic trace, just that we don’t know how to find it.
Similarly the studies show (in their selected samples) the high levels of haplogroups associated with anglo saxons and the like in the English South East and English midlands, but then dropping off as you move away - what does that tell you really - if every man in South East England was killed, but sufficient women were spared then the native DNA would still persist.
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I’m no expert, but I imagine it’s because those people in Southern England are Anglo-Saxon, decendents of previous invaders of England, whereas Welsh people are decended from Celts - the original inhabitants of the British Isles. So although not surprising, it would show that people in Pembrokeshire are a pocket of “invaders” rather than of Welsh ancestry.
Or that would be my take on it, anyway.
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I did some history on my local area in the Swansea Valley and from memory, since it was some time ago - a large manor house was owned by a family from Somerset, who also had homes in Somerset and the head of the family had a fancy title like the sheriff or mayor of Pembroke Dock or Milford Haven. In his work he mentioned, Lord Nelson popping in on his way to Ireland via Milford/Pembroke.
Nelson also referred to Milford as one of the finest deep water harbours in the world. I think that area was strategically important and also economically important for trade with Ireland and it could just be that a lot of people with status or in the military/navy from Somerset, Devon, Dorset etc etc, simply set up home there - there maybe didn’t need to be any sort of battles or anything else, just money and status talking.
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