SSi Forum

[now starting to publish] Level 3 northern


#82

Thank you - that sounds like a glitch of some kind - @kinetic, can you have a squint and see what’s happened there, and if we need to re-record? :slight_smile:


#83

Oops, looks like that was a mistake in the text which was imported into the system - Catrin and Aran both recorded what the system asked them to, in fairness to them :wink: Just that the system had a pair of texts which didn’t quite correspond. I’ve updated this now so I guess they’ll be re-recording them along with the next batch of recordings they do, after which I’ll be able to re-produce the file.


#84

Just wondering what the planned release schedule is…or is it a when it’s ready sort of schedule :slight_smile:


#85

Enjoyed session 2. No gripes.

I don’t mind the introduction of mutated verbs (brynu, daflu)
On the whole the sentences have the implied “ei…fo” structure which mutates the verbs anyway. Or, as we’re using “medra i” that would trigger the mutation too. I think introducing “prynu” might lead to a lot of “Medra i prynu fo” being said - although not a major problem, I understand the use of the mutated verbs.


#86

This one… :slight_smile:

But we’re very confident now that it’s going to be a much faster process than Level 2 was… :slight_smile:


#87

Actually just for my own sanity would this be

Byddet ti’n dweud wrthaf fi fod o 'di gorffen 'set ti’n gwybod, faset ti?


#88

Now I’m getting confused, not having done the Northern course this has rasied a few questions in my head. Is there a subtle distinction between byddet/fyddet and baset/faset. I had thought in my head byddet more Southern, Faset more northern, but essentially the same thing? If they are the same, then having both forms in the same sentence has taken me a bit by surprise I suppose - is this how it is?


#89

Mmmm… I don’t really think so… maybe close enough work would show some different patterns of usage depending on north/south, but around here I’d say they’re pretty interchangeable. In fact, the reason we’re reaching out now with this range of stuff is because you’re very likely to hear both of these on a regular basis… :slight_smile:


#90

Just been reading Gareth King, because I know I have a knowledge gap here, but none the wiser. He says although the Baswn set is usually associated with the North, both sets are widely used all over Wales - I’ve always had problems with this area and I guess it was the mix and matching that I have trouble with - I thought it was either or, but obviously not.

I’m happy remembering the patterns on the Southern Course, which seem to mix and match as well, but something is still niggling away, because I don’t quite understand the subtleties and variations here properly.


#91

So @aran does this mean we could say

Baset ti’n dweud wrthaf fi taset ti’n medru gwneud o, faset ti?

or even end it with ‘fyddet ti’?


#92

Baswn and byddwn mean exactly the same. I know that many prefer using Baswn because it’s less ambiguous than the byddaf / byddwn form.


#93

I’ve been reading a lot about this in the last hour and it is one for the language experts me-thinks. There seems to be wide variations in uses and forms. Things that I thought were the same and simply dialect differences are not necessarily derived from the same form of bod, but their usage might happen to be similar. I’m being cryptic because I’m getting myself lost a bit.

to get a flavour - read this forum Wales post - note the pluperfect subjunctives and imperfect subjunctives - words that mean absolutely nothing to me at all.

http://www.forumwales.co.uk/fwforum/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=8311&start=15

These questions seem to come around again and again and I have never seen it really explained in a language I can understand.


#94

Sorry I missed your comment Anthony - I’m not sure they are necessarily the same, although they may tend to mean exactly the same thing if that makes sense. I know a man who does know (@garethrking) and I’ve been reading his book alongside various other things and i’m now more confused about all the variations here as i’ve ever been.


#95

I wish i’d never asked now! :wink:


#96

Wow! That’s way beyond my understanding

From my experience, in spoken Welsh they’re used interchangeably. So, I’m not going to stress about the intricacies.


#97

Good advice. I don’t understand grammatical terms at all. I thought a pluperfect was a cocktail.

The other day on memrise i came across…cymal enwol…which means nominative clause. No idea what this means in English so God knows where this gets used or put in welsh!!!

Efallai, yn twll tyn ifan y saer?


#98

That’s two of us.

No, it’s a nice feather.

Cheers J.P.


#99

Pluperfect learned at school, never needed to know it since! I think past past not just then, but was then then! I had happened then!
Nominative clause _ well nominative is subject of sentence, so it would be clause that is doing something! @garethrking help! Am I right? Can’t think of a clause suitable to be subject of sentence! :wink:


#100

You’d probably find the switch to ‘fyddet ti’ at the end would sound a little unnatural/unexpected - but nothing major.

Yup, this… :slight_smile:

@toffidil - it’s normal to feel a bit uncertain about it, because it’s an extra range of options. But ignoring it until you’ve had enough exposure/usage to develop your own preferences will work out fine for you… :slight_smile:


#101

They’re not EXACTLY the same, though for the ‘would’ meanings they are. In my experience native speakers don’t tend to mix them, i.e. you’re either a byddwn etc speaker or a baswn etc speaker.

BUT byddwn etc has another use which baswn etc doesn’t share, namely: habitual past : byddwn i’n mynd am dro ar y traeth bob Dydd Sul I used to go for a walk on the beach every Sunday. You can’t use baswn for this meaning - everyone uses byddwn.