Tiny questions with quick answers - continuing thread

Isn’t it Holl Sant (without the i)?

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no, because ‘saint’ here is the Welsh plural, not the English single!

PS, for All Saints Church (e.g. Gresford, Maerdy, etc) this would be “Eglwys Yr Holl Saint”

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In the northern course you’ll be taught “isio” (ee-sho) for “want” (heard all over the place too, often shortened even further in speech to “-sho”) comes from eisiau (ay-sh-eye)…just to give you a benchmark as to how far dipthongs can change :smile:

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OK – so I went back and re-read what @garethrking had to say in his grammar about focused sentences. Partly because I have read it before, no doubt, and also because I’ve read and heard and spoken more Welsh since the last time I read it, it all seemed to make more sense than the last time I read it, and so I think I’ve more or less got it, although there are some of these I’m a little less certain about than others. So, how do the following statement/question pairs look?

Mae Dylan yn mynd i mewn i’r dref.
Ydy Dylan yn mynd i mewn i’r dref?
(Dylan is going into town - Is Dylan going into town?)

I mewn i’r dref mae Dylan yn mynd.
Ai i mewn i’r dref mae Dylan yn mynd?
(Dylan is going into town etc.)

Mynd i mewn i’r dref mae Dylan.
Ai mynd i mewn i’r dref mae Dylan?

Dylan sy’n mynd i mewn i’r dref.
Ai Dylan sy’n mynd i mewn i’r dref?

Mae Dylan yn athro.
Ydy Dylan yn athro?
(Dylan is a teacher.)

Ignore the next one, because it’s wrong (see Gareth’s reply):
**Dylan ydy athro.
Ai Dylan ydy athro?
(Dylan is a teacher. Or is he?!?)

Athro ydy Dylan.
Ai athro ydy Dylan?

Fi torrodd y llestri. [should be dorrodd]
Ai fi torrodd y llestri? [should be dorrodd]
(It was me that broke the dishes.)

Dan ni yno.
Ydan ni yno (eto)?
(We are there.)

Yno dan ni.
Ai yno dan ni?
(We are there.)

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This is the only one of your example pairs that is wrong - it is simply not Welsh, and cannot be because it uses an identification pattern for what is not an identification (i.e. singling out) sentence. So just delete this one. :slight_smile:

And these are correct except that they require Soft Mutation of the verb beause the subject precedes (remember that the subject or notional subject of a sentence is followed by SM)

Fi dorrodd y llestri
Ai fi dorrodd y llestri?

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Right: thanks++ for the feedback, and I’m glad they are by and large right – it’s largely thanks to your explanations elsewhere that that much is right.

And that SM on the last one has got me annoyed with myself – I don’t think I’ve ever (yet) used these focused patterns in active speech, but I know damn’ well that you mutate after the subject.

But the **Dylan ydy athro one has still got me genuinely slightly confused – I’m aware that the distinction between identification and description is not yet natural to me, and something I’m still kind of grappling with – insofar as I don’t really get why that is ungrammatical, because not an identification, but Athro ydy Dylan isn’t. Is there a moderately straightforward reason?

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Here we go:

In both

Athro [verb to be] Dylan = Dylan is a TEACHER (not a fireman)
and
Dylan [verb to be] athro = DYLAN is a teacher (not Huw)

the subject is Dylan. But because the focus is different, the subject is in a different place (before vs after the verb to be), and when the present tense of bod FOLLOWS the subject, it has to be sy(dd)

So we have`:

Athro ydy Dylan = Dylan is a TEACHER

but

Dylan sy’n athro = DYLAN is a teacher

So it’s really a special little rule about sy/ydy/mae.

:slight_smile:

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Lovely – I’d got that sorted for him going into town, but failed to apply it here. That makes it clear. Thank you!

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Isn’t this fun? :slight_smile:

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Wel, fi sy’n ei fwynhau (he says, gambling on it coming out as your actual Welsh) :slight_smile:

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Wel, mi wnes i ddeall hi

Not that that counts for much… I’m more likely to be wrong than you are!

Also, I agree. I find all this grammar stuff fascinating. I don’t understand a lot of it, but it’s still enjoyable to have an expert explain it to us plebs :slight_smile:

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It may be fun for you, but I just feel like I’ve done 10 rounds with Muhamed Ali when he was young enough to be called Cassius Clay. :wink:

Well, no, it is fun really, but it’s a bit like mental acrobatics. If you can land more or less on your feet, even if a bit unsteadily, instead of on your ochr cefn, you are more or less winning. :slight_smile:

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An expert is simply a pleb who’s been round the block a few more times than the other plebs. :wink:

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Hi, @gisella-albertini Nothing to do with Welsh, just an off-topic Sunday afternoon question:
Are you in a Fiat 500 Cinquecento? :grin:

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Hey @JohnYoung,
you mean in my forum picture or on holiday now? :grin:
The first is a Volvo 240 - about 4 meters longer than a 500, heh heh!
On holiday, change in plans, a Triumph motorbike (I can only be a passenger and it’s impossible to chat, which is good for my Welsh training practice by the way!)

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Ooooh! We had one of those - my all time favourite car! :grinning:

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Hi,
HE DIDNT TELL ME…
In 22 this is ddwywedodd e ddim wrtha I…

But just into 23 becomes…
Naeth e ddim dweud wrtha I …

Could someone clarify…please!

Don’t panic Mike! They are both valid ways of saying “He didn’t tell me”, they are just using different construction patterns. You’ll come across both but it’s fine to stick with whichever one you prefer or whichever comes to mind first. :slight_smile:

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Hi Mike,

I would look at these as just two different ways of essentially saying the same thing - use them as ways to inject variation.

For clarity, they are both forms of the past tense.

Dyweddodd e - follows the past tense of things like “Siaradais i”, “dechreuais i”, “welais i” “welodd e” etc.

Whereas

Naeth e ddim dweud… - follows the past tense of things like “Wnes i”, “wnaeth e”, “wnaeth hi”. Basically equals “I did”, “I did not” “He did” “he did not” etc.

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Cheers Siaron & Nicky,
Much appreciated :+1:

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