SSi Forum

Welsh dictionaries - problems with verbs


#1

Find it frustrating that for things like future tense , conditional tense - of the basic verb ‘to be’ Welsh dictionaries seem not to be in agreement on the popular form ; in some cases the same author appears to present different forms in different Welsh language books . I am taking GRAMADEG CYMRAEG CYFOES page 30 ( Future tense - bydda i etc ) as the one to use for future tense . For the conditional I am taking page 33 alternative form of affirmative in the same publication ( byddwn i etc ) in the same publication. Unless anyone can show that another form of these tenses are used most widely in South Wales ?
John


#2

Sorry, I don’t understand the problem here. The future tense and the conditional tense are not the same, so I don’t find it surprising that the Welsh forms differ. bydda i = I will, byddwn i = I would. :man_shrugging:


#3

Could you give some examples of those different forms so we can see where the confusion is coming from?


#4

Dear Hendrik,
Of course the future and conditional tenses are different - I was not suggesting they were not. What I am saying is that across a number of dictionaries the representations of tenses of the verb bod ( to be ) differ substantially and possibly only the OUP Modern Welsh Dictionary represents what is in common use in South Wales ?
Regards,
John


#5

In GRAMADEG Cymraeg CYFOES : future is Bydda I, byddi di, bydd e , byddwn ni, byddwch chi, byddan nhw; conditional for affirmative is Baswn i … or alternatively Byddwn i … ( this form also in the OUP Modern Welsh dict. ). In Welsh Learners dict. we have : future - fe fydda i … ( popular form ) . The OUP dict. Seems to be the best for my level of learning.

Regards,
John


#6

Right, ok.
It’s just a matter of choice. They are all equally correct just that different forms are preferred in various areas/dialects. Dictionaries generally don’t/can’t list every variation - they choose what they think is the most common, but what is common to one dictionary editor may not be the most common one for the next dictionary editor.
“Bydda”, is based on the full proper form “byddaf” - usually the f drops off in speech - and sometimes it mutates after the positive particle fe (or ‘mi’ in some areas), but it really doesn’t matter which you use.
The conditional is a bit trickier, with two sets to choose from - an extremely light rule of thumb is the byddwn set in the South and the baswn set in the North, but this is by no means set in stone, as you’ll hear both wherever you are depending on which the speaker prefers to use.

It’s fine to choose one and stick to it, but useful to be aware of the others so they don’t throw you when you hear or read them elsewhere. The best way to choose is to listen to what people around you use and use that.