Mohono fi etc

In course 3 lesson 10 we are introduced to the mohono family. I understand that they mean ‘not me, etc’ , but there is no explanation as when to use them. Could someone please explain when to use these. Thank you.

“Mo” is used in negative sentences with short forms of verbs in the past, I believe, when there verb takes a definite object (pronoun, proper noun, place name or a noun which is definite and takes the definite article). “Welais i mo’r ffilm” (mo because the film). When the object of the negative short verb is a pronoun it becomes “mohono i, mohonot ti” and so on: “Welais i mohono fe”. At least, that’s what me textbook says.

4 Likes

Stella’s given you a good grammatical overview - meanwhile, the SSiAnswer is not to worry about it - let them come out when they occur to you, and recognise when you hear other people using them, and it’ll all work out well in the end… :sunny:

2 Likes

Thank you Stella. I can see it now.
Aran, SSIW is teaching me to accept and not have to dissect everything but that pesky ‘why’ crops up now and then and stops me in my tracks. I hadn’t made the connection with ‘mo’ and ‘hono’ but as soon as I saw that I got the word but of course where to use it will have to come with practise as you said. I am encouraged because I am beginning to make connections myself now as I’m beginning to see how the language works.

1 Like

If it helps you, “mohono fe” etc. is from “dim ohono fe”, “mo” is from “dim o”

4 Likes

Far as I can tell, 'mo is basically ddim o - so 'mohono is ddim ohono (since instead of o fi, you say ohono fi). It’s basically a contraction, except in Welsh rather than English.

4 Likes

Snap! :wink:

1 Like

Got it. Thanks.

2 Likes

OK, I’m not yet at that Level, but where contractions lead to something that is very different positive from negative, I would have thought a little explanation would help? No?

I am not sure if this helps, or if the fact that there is a contraction is a source of confusion, but there is a very common pattern in Welsh where (d)dim becomes just 'm as part of the natural flow of pronunciation.

Dim o -> Mo is one example, there are many others, like sydd ddim -> sy’m, wnes i ddim ennill -> wnes i’m ennill, this last on from ‘hi oedd fy ffrind’ by Bethan Gwanas

2 Likes

If you believe in an approach to language learning driven by a conscious understanding of the grammar, yes. But that’s not my methodology. :sunny:

3 Likes

“mond” for “dim ond” is quite common I think.

4 Likes

I heard that on S4C last night or the night before! Or in Cyw yn y fore!

I realise that I’m WAAAAAY behind the times here, but we’ve just come across mohono etc on our formal(ish) … ie classroom … Welsh class . Suffice to say I was completely confused!
This thread has helped quite a lot … so thank you all :relieved:

2 Likes

Yes. I’d say shortening everything to the absolute minimum in casual speech is the way to go. It even works in English.

Here’s a genuine conversation I heard in work:
Lisa: 'right Mint?
Minty (dont ask): 'Right Lise?
(End of conversation)
:smiley:

1 Like