Tiny questions with quick answers - continuing thread

Welsh General / Questions
#259

It’s a very common problem here in Russia/Belarus with children (because as you know we have this very hard-sounding pretty R), but parents normally take them to the logopedics specialists, and most of them fix it. I can look up for some techniques how to pronounce the sound, maybe they could help Welsh learners.

(I had a problem with it too, when I was very small, one of my most vivid memories is, on arriving home, running across the airport field to my grandmother, shouting "Granny, I’ve learned how to say “RRRRRRRRRRR!” scaring all the people around. I was very proud to have learned it at last:)

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#260

Hi @wrenmoyer - it’s not really a “version of bod” that you haven’t learnt, it’s just a colloquial dislike of complication.

“Bo fi” should, grammatically, be “fy mod i”, but you’ll hear bo fi just as often if not more so. Bo ti, bo fe, bo hi etc are the same.

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#261

Oh!! Exactly the feeling I remember when I yelled “Dadadadada” in my pram!!!

#262

I noted in one Challenge the explanation of using ‘e’ or ‘hi’ for it, and it not mattering which… all fine. But in the actual example, I would have said ‘hi’ because there was a vowel making it hard to say ‘e’…whatever. Or I’d have said ‘fe’, which wasn’t mentioned. I nearly sent a query about ‘fe’, but thought maybe it was gogledd. Seeing it in your mailing, can I say ‘fe’ for he or it when it makes the sentence easier to say??

#263

“bo fe” = “fod e” = “that he / (masculine) it”

(Don’t worry too much about the “masculine it” bit. If you do want to know, for an abstract “it” you’re probably best off using “hi” (feminine it), although as far as I understand it it’s one of those things that are best just not worried about at all!)

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#264

This is simple and complicated at the same time.

Simple, because you’re not really saying “it”. We don’t have the third gender in Welsh, there is only he or she, so you choose one or the other as you please. Obviously, talking about people, the choice is made for you, but for objects and less specific things that’s where it gets more…

Complicated because every noun in Welsh has a gender - either masculine or feminine - and you should use the correct gender when your speaking. As a second language speaker, there is a good chance that you will never get all your genders right, and most of the time, no-one will notice. Sometimes gender is different in different areas, for instance “corner” is feminine in the north and masculine in the south. Tavern can be the same. Page, on the other hand, is the other way round… If you “get it wrong”, you might be “right” anyway, and no-one is likely to notice exept for the commonest of words.

One thing to bear in mind - things that aren’t really objects are usually “hi” (she). So, while “Teh Weather” is masculine, when we are talking about “It is warm”, wee say “mae hi’n dwym”, because the “it” here isn’t anything really. You could equally well point around you up and down at the air and the floor and each other and say “warm”. Bu even if you get this “wrong”, it will be barely noticed.

You’re right on the “fe/e” thing - use fe where there’s a vowel, and e where there’s not for masculine objects. Feminine objects are always hi, vowel or no vowel.

See, I said it was simple, didn’t I (runs away, suddenly realising how much “simple to a first language speaker” is “impenetrable to an early phase second language speaker”). You will take to it as second nature as you get more used to the language, so just roll with it, and accept that sometimes you will say it differently to us, and it doesn;t matter!

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On i'n ? or not
#265

Thank you for making that so clear!!
Personally, having learned (well, more accurately, ‘been taught’, conventionally, and forgotten most, I am used to ‘hi’ for the weather and tend to use ‘hi’ just generally. Naughty Jackie didn’t actually consider the word I was replacing with ‘it’!!! So your posting is very, very good for me!! (It is a slapped hand you didn’t even know I needed!!!) :sunny:

#266

And if I remember correctly (but sorry, my memory is lousy though if you remember me complaining abouot that allover this forum) this was explained very clearly in either in Challenge 4 itself or in 3rd one. I don’t remember exactly but I know it was explained very clearly about “bo” “bod” and why it turns to “bo fi”. (not sure I’ve spelt it right but anyway … )

#267

My problem, later, Tatjana, was that I wasn’t sure what I was hearing and I kept being distracted by my own tendency to use half gog and half de expressions!! (e,g, Definitely ‘hoffi’, not ‘licio’, but I still tend to think ‘eisia’ for want!)

#268

“moyn” definately more familiar to me … :slight_smile:

Oh, don’t tell this to me … I’m distracted by myself all the time. I know (mostly) exactly what I’m hearing and I many times know why something is put that way as @Iestyn explains things very well, but, as I said, my memory is lousy. I can remember that something was explained and many times I even can remember why things are as such, but when comming to use/say something walla! here we are! Out of confusion there comes nothing out from me and then I am not certain anymore did I remember explanation right or it was all just something different.

Eh, my brains always play tricks with me … - hehe :slight_smile:

#269

Dw i wedi anghofio mwy 'na dw i’n medru (gallu) cofio, felly, dw i ddim yn swr beth dw i wedi anghofio.
I have forgotten more than i can remember, so i’m not sure what i have forgotten.

Cheers J.P.

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#270

Rwybeth newydd bob dydd. - hehe (i anghofio ac cofio).

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#271

Inspired by an email from Benny Lewis, I have been keeping a journal in Welsh every day for about the last month. The entries are short and simple (“Wnes i wneud rhywbeth, wnes i wneud rhwybeth arall” sort of thing) but I’m finding it to be good practice in thinking about sentence structure, mutations, and spelling. And learning new vocabulary. However, prepositions are a struggle! I’m sure I’m getting most of them wrong. If I cooked something or ate something for supper, do I say “Wnes i goginio/fwyta cawl i swper” or “am swper” or something else?

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#272

There is a discussion of this here:

http://www.forumwales.com/fwforum/viewtopic.php?f=34&t=6608

If I read this correctly, it looks like the “i’s” have it, i.e. "i swper " (or “i frecwast” or “i ginio”) for when you mean what you are having for supper, breakfast, dinner, etc. But if it’s where you are talking about e.g. where you are going for supper, it seems it could be “i” or “am”.

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#273

Thanks, Mike Ellwood

The first two are new to me. I have used the third one (geiriadur.net) often, but the first (gweiadur.com) has many valuable external links which I’m sure that I will use frequently, also! So thanks again.

#274

Yup, that’s fine… :sunny: And well done on the journal, that’s a great approach!

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#275

@mikeellwood Thanks for the info and that link! That was very helpful. (Although I think that thread as a whole doesn’t necessarily help me feel encouraged about getting prepositions figured out anytime soon :smile: It’s a complicated subject! )

@aran Thanks for the confirmation and the encouragement! I am enjoying keeping the journal, and it will be fun to go back later and see how much I’ve improved. Gobeithio! :slight_smile:

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#276

Yes, that’s one of the biggest benefits (which helps solve feeling that you’re on a plateau, also)… :sunny:

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#277

You do remember correctly! :smile:

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#278

Can anyone tell me which is the best physical (as opposed to online) dictionary for North Wales terminology? Thanks